Narayan Numbers

[laroon]

Okay so here we go into the number system. I know 1 - 19 is correct. The rest are just speculation. The numbered pages in Saavedro's Journal go to 17. (home.comcast.net/~dni-books/EXILEJournals/JournalSaavedroFull.htm to see)



The main numberals are 1 - 5, and then 5 with 1 for six, 5 with 2 for 7, etc. until 10. See how 9 turns into 10?

Then it just starts over.

For 20, I use the concept of 2-10's. It was either this, or have 10-10 for twenty, 10-10-10, for thirty, and keep going till 90 of a group of nine 10's. That would be silly.

This works for 1-99. But 100 was a little different. I had originally done 10-10 for 100. But this was strange when getting into the higher place digits. Also, I needed a concept for 0. Tying all together, it works well now. So now it's 10-0 for 100, and then it'd continue with 10-0-0 for the thousands place, 10-0-0-0 for the ten-thousands place, etc. I think this will work.

No names are given to the numbers yet.

[dlordoftime]

Well, I guess it's either place-value, or more and more symbols for whatever base the Narayani counting system uses.

[laroon]

Right yeah. It's like.. compounded base 5, so it mimics a base 10. I thought it looked like fingers on your hand. When you finish counting one one hand, you move to your other one. When you run out of fingers, that's it.

Though I wonder if 20 should be another symbol (if you indeed are then counting toes too ) But then something like 56 would be 2 20 10 5 1 which might get more confusing than need be, plus it would be asking for yet another symbol. So I think what we have now is ideal.

[dlordoftime]

Indeed, what you have thought up is a wonderful system mimicking the way we learn to count using our fingers.

[laroon]

Well I just followed the pattern from the games. This makes sense to continue this way.

[dlordoftime]

I was thinking that the way you've done multiples of ten is by saying how many people's fingers' are being used. Example: 53 is 5 people are contributing their fingers, and then three more fingers.

[laroon]

Well thanks. I'm just glad that his unique number system works itself out.

[laroon]

I've gone ahead and named the numbers. This system is simple, and easy to follow. With this, we'll be able to count from 0 to 999,999,999.

0 - Zod 1 - Elu 2 - Lin 3 - Sher 4 - Niut 5 - Taki 6 - Oki 7 - Hep 8 - Krao 9 - Shen 10 - Hino 11 - Hinelu 12 - Hinlin 13 - Hinsher 14 - Hinniut 15 - Hintaki 16 - Hinoki 17 - Hinhep 18 - Hinkrao 19 - Hinshen 20 - Linza 21 - Linzaelu 22 - Linzalin 23 - Linzasher 24 - Linzaniut 25 - Linzataki 26 - Linzaoki 27 - Linzahep 28 - Linzakrao 29 - Linzashen

30 - sherza 31 - sherzaelu 32 - sherzalin 33 - sherzasher 34 - sherzaniut 35 - sherzataki 36 - sherzaoki 37 - sherzahep 38 - sherzakrao 39 - sherzashen 40 - niutza 41 - niutzaelu 42 - niutzalin 43 - niutzasher 44 - niutzanuit 45 - niutzataki 46 - niutzaoki 47 - niutzahep 48 - niutzakrao 49 - niutzashen 50 - takiza 51 - takizaelu 52 - takizalin 53 - takizasher 54 - takizanuit 55 - takizataki 56 - takizaoki 57 - takizahep 58 - takizakrao 59 - takizashen

60 - okiza 61 - okizaelu 62 - okizalin 63 - okizasher 64 - okizanuit 65 - okizataki 66 - okizaoki 67 - okizahep 68 - okizakrao 69 - okizashen 70 - hepza 71 - hepzaelu 72 - hepzalin 73 - hepzasher 74 - hepzanuit 75 - hepzataki 76 - hepzaoki 77 - hepzahep 78 - hepzakrao 79 - hepzashen 80 - kraoza 81 - kraozaelu 82 - kraozalin 83 - kraozasher 84 - kraozanuit 85 - kraozataki 86 - kraozaoki 87 - kraozahep 88 - kraozakrao 89 - kraozashen

90 - shenza 91 - shenzaelu 92 - shenzalin 93 - shenzasher 94 - shenzanuit 95 - shenzataki 96 - shenzaoki 97 - shenzahep 98 - shenzakrao 99 - shenzashen 100 - otali 101 - otalielu 102 - otalilin 103 - otalisher 104 - otalinuit 105 - otalitaki 106 - otalioki 107 - otalihep 108 - otalikrao 109 - otalishen 110 - otalihino 111 - otalihinelu 112 - otalihinlin 113 - otalihinsher 114 - otalihinniut 115 - otalihintaki 116 - otalihinoki 117 - otalihinhep 118 - otalihinkrao 119 - otalihinshen

120 - otalilinza 121 - otalilinzaelu 122 - otalilinzalin 123 - otalilinzasher 124 - otalilinzaniut 125 - otalilinzataki 126 - otalilinzaoki 127 - otalilinzahep 128 - otalilinzakrao 129 - otalilinzashen 130 - otalisherza 131 - otalisherzaelu 132 - otalisherzalin 133 - otalisherzasher 134 - otalisherzaniut 135 - otalisherzataki 136 - otalisherzaoki 137 - otalisherzahep 138 - otalisherzakrao 139 - otalisherzashen 140 - otaliniutza 141 - otaliniutzaelu 142 - otaliniutzalin 143 - otaliniutzasher 144 - otaliniutzaniut 145 - otaliniutzataki 146 - otaliniutzaoki 147 - otaliniutzahep 148 - otaliniutzakrao 149 - otaliniutzashen

200 - linotali 300 - sherotali 400 - niutotali 500 - takiotali 600 - okiotali 700 - hepotali 800 - kraotali 900 - shenotali 999 - shenotalishenzashen 1000 - zhinao 1,000,000 - mikae

0 - 10 are just basics.

For the teens, you just do hin (from hino) + the 1's digit.

So hin(o) + elu (1) = 11.

To make the multiples of 10 (20, 30, 40, etc), just add "za" to the end of the normal numbers. Eluza doesn't exist. That's just Hino.
From the za versions, just add the normal numbers again:

Linza, linzaelu, linzalin, linzasher....

That'll get you up to 99. 100 is elu otali. Just add the numbers on the end like this: elu otali shen za lin = 192

To make multiples of 100, just add the normal numbers before again (just like za). So you have, for example, hep otali taki za oki for 756.
One irregular here is 800 - kraotali. It should be Karo otali, but it drops an o to bring it together. So it's just kraotali.

This will get you to 999.

1000 is just elu zhinao, and again works like 100's.

Eluzhinao, linzhinao, sherzhinao, niutzhinao...
This will get you to 999,999 (shen otali shen za shen zhinao shen otali shen za shen).

1 million is elu mikae. Elumikae, linmikae, shermikae, etc.

You now can make any number from Zod to Shen otali shen za shen mikae shen otali shen za shen zhinao shen otali shen za shen.

Here are a few examples of large numbers.

Shen za hep zhinao lin otali taki. 97,205
Okiza elu mikae taki otali lin zhinao elu. - 61,502,001
Elu otali hinelu mikae lin otali linza lin zhinao sher otali sher za sher. - 111,222,333.

Happy counting!

[dlordoftime]

It looks very... sloppy, I guess. It breaks your own rule of simplicity. Man, it's more complex even than French! Any chance you could, perhaps, shrink it, a bit?

[laroon]

o.o It like ... english. I don't see what's confusing...

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten.
Elu, lin, sher, niut, taki, oki, hep, krao, shen, hino.

Evelen, twelve, thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen, eightteen, nineteen
Hinelu, hinlin, hinsher, hinniut, hintaki, hinoki, hinhep, hinkrao, hinshen.

Then 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90 are all made by adding "za" to the 8 numbers (not elu):

Linza, sherza, niutza, takiza, okiza, hepza, kraoza, shenza.
Twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, sixty, seventy, eighty, ninety.

You can then make numbers like 25 like: linza + taki, so Linzataki. This is literally Twenty+five = twentyfive.

Hundreds work the same way. "otali" = "hundred"

Elu otali,lin otali, sher otali, niut otali, taki otali, oki otali, hep otali, krao otali, shen otali.
one hundred, two hundred, three hundred, four hundred, five hundred, six hundred, seven hundred, eight hundred, nine hundred.

Again, just append the numbers from before to make numbers-

Niut otali hepza oki = Four hundred, seventy six. Literally.

One thousand is zhinao. Again, just put numbers 1 - 9 in front of it. And then that thousands can go up to 999 thousand - shen otali shenza shen zhinao is literally nine hundred ninety nine thousand.

The next step is million which is just miake. Just like thousand, it can go up and up to 999 million before we'd need a word for "billion" and so on.

shen otali shenza shen miake, shen otali shenza shen zhinao, shen otali shenza shen zhinao
nine hundred ninety nine million, nine hundred ninety nine thousand, nine hundred ninety nine.

Pretty dang straight forward.

Or if you want one more example, 123,456,789

elu otali linza sher miake, niut otali takiza oki zhinao, hep otali kraoza shen.
One hundred twenty three million, four hundred fifty six thousand, seven hundred eighty nine.

[dlordoftime]

It's really hard for me to find the right word for what I mean... I guess what I should say instead is that it looks rather hastily cobbled together, kind of. It doesn't follow the way the written numbers work. So, for each symbol and power of ten, there should be a single syllable word, which can then be combined. For example, 68 would be formed five-one-ten five-three, just as with the symbols given.

[laroon]

Yeah I don't really have time to go through and show you how each piece of the magic system works. I taught a friend; she picked it up in about 2 min. So I mean, I have other things to do. Sorry you don't like it, but that's not really the breaking point for me.

[dlordoftime]

No, it's easy enough to understand, but it would be better if each part were monosyllabic, and followed how you did the written numbers. Example: 1 ~ o, 2 ~ du, 3 ~ ta, 4 ~ cæ, 5 ~ si, 6 (5+1) ~ si-o, 7 ~ sidu, 10 ~ de, 11 ~ de-o, 12 ~ de-u, 13 ~ de-a, 14 ~ de-æ, 15 ~ desi, 16 ~ desi-o... 99 ~ si-ædesi-æ, 100 ~ ce, 101, ce-o, etc.

Something like that. Single syllables, harsher sounds reserved for the very, very big numbers since they don't really sound as nice...

[laroon]

Lol it's not Chinese, man. We say "one hundred" for 100. And, using syllables, one hundred one should be 1001 then, right? But it's not They're just numerals. Not Chinese characters.

Another weird thing - we say "seventeen" for 17. Why doesn't the seven come first? o.o

Haha. Numbers are just weird. This system isn't that difficult.

A supporting comment to this system, is that the numbers for 6-9 are not two separate numerals, but rather treated as one idea. This is the power of the Narayan culture and community. Because they're such a tightly wound group, even items (people, cultures, everything) can be brought together into the same place.

Thus, Alani. Don't think of the numbers as different entities, but rather compounded ideas.

[dlordoftime]

I know six through nine are one number, which is why I dropped consonant to just have the vowel, but, like the numbers, the words still show their origins. And one hundred one would literally be that, (one) hundred (and) one. And since when did it have to be based on English? And I am surprised you didn't comment on the Romance basis with which I created that example.